I decided to put this post into a pastebin since it became pretty damn huge.
It explains how YOU can become an actual wizard!
I also posted this on 8chan/fringe/.
Seeker 2016-04-17 14:15:22 No.2337
Good thing this thread pop'd up was about to dump this pic in /loosh/ I guess its somewhat related here.
Its a screencap from an Odalist forum and I found there breakdown of the 5 body's of man very good.
The purpose of this thread is to explain through logical conclusions mixed with "plausible ideas" that magic is, in fact, pretty damn real. Of course since the source of all this is my own thought I may be a bit biased, but my explainations do not require occult, psychic, biblical, astral or whatever kind of typical fringe-knowledge.
Because of this I like to think that this thread will be very helpfull for people new to this board.
The definition of magic here is "manipulating physical reality". We're talking, for example, telekinesis, flying, throwing fireballs, manipulation of probability or just "making things happen" in general. Obviously you are not seeing a lot of this around you, but I can explain why.
But first of all you need to understand: You can already do this, and you probably did. And you did it in your DREAMS. Obviously that doesn't count, you may think, but the chances of reality itself just being a dream are extremely high. How so? Think of it this way: Science tells us that there are many, many different universes because of the string theory. Even if we don't believe in it the chance of the birth of our universe being a totally unique, special thing is pretty low considering that the requirements for it's birth - simple nonexistance - are easily met. So the chances of there being infinite universes is pretty high. The "problem" is, though: Each of these universes contains many, many virtual universes. Computers today are already very capable of creating virtual worlds. While we are not yet at the stage of moving conciousness there we will probably soon be and then it's only a matter of complexity as for how real a world has to seem in order to be officially considered "real". However, we are already way ahead of this. We ourself create virtual worlds every night - our brains are very capable computers and they throw us into reality simulations every night and usually we can't even tell that they are not real and if we do it's not because of a lack of quality of the simulation, but because weird shit happens there that doesn't make sense in the "real" world.
So, each brain has the potential to create a universe. Though while there already are people who go so "crazy" that they literally live in their own little world in their heads, let's keep it real though: What our brains can create is probably still not complex enough to keep up with the world we live in. That's not a problem though. Because the universe is way bigger then the world we actually observe, and way older then us. All it needs is ONE planet per universe where beings live that are capable of dreaming up universes and the chance of a the universe you just so happen to live in to be a dream or simulation skyrockets. And it goes without saying that this shit goes full Inception too, with dreams/simulations being possible WITHIN the dreams/simulations.
So, I think the point I tried to make has been made. While not entirely impossible, the chance of this universe being a dream is ridiculously high.
"Ok, cool, so what?", you may be thinking. "I still can't do in this dream what I can do in my own."
Of course, and there are reasons for this.
First of all, obviously this dream is not dreamed by one person alone. There are many, many conciousnesses within this dream that also exist and also dream. I suspect that this is what makes such a complex universe possible in the first place, as more dreamers mean more processing power for the simulation. But that also means that the power over this dream is divided between every soul, which limits the individual amount of control you have. So you're not the allmighty god you are in your own dream.
However, another limiting factor is much bigger then this one. To be fair I must disclaim though that this is more of an idea then a logical conclusion. While you are currently inside of a dream, you are not in a dream-state. You are awake right now. You are not dreaming. This basically means that you experience this dream in a "experience"-mode, not a "create"-mode, so to speak. When you are asleep and dreaming you obviously create you own reality, so what's different?
For this you need to think about what makes you dream in the first place. The answer is: DMT. A drug your brain releases to put you into the dream-state. This substance is called the "spirit particle" by spiritual communities everywhere and most consider it the holy grail of spiritual drugs. However, if you were to just smoke that stuff you would just be send into an individual dream within yourself again or, if you are lucky, you astral project (but that's a different story entirely and I don't want to open that chapter right now). Obviously you don't go god-mode, quite the opposite you become a helpless, drooling little baby in this reality while having a very intense dream experience on the inside. Pretty cool, pretty usefull to get to know yourself and to get in touch with the universe on a spiritual level, but not magic. Why is that?
The problem is: It's simply too much of it at once, and it doesn't last long enough to take the amount you'd need to be "dreaming" in reality slowly. Some old tribes, especially in Africa, tried to solve this problem by creating a very complicated to brew potion that releases the DMT in a less agressive way, called ayahuasca, but it still sends you to your own dream-land, though from what I have heard in a less intense way. Still, not what we're looking for. (Though I'd still love to get my hands on this stuff.)
So we're running out of options if we want to become wizards, obviously. However, the solution is actually kind of simple. Your brain already is capable of producing it. We just have to trick it into producing the right amounts of DMT necessary. And, apparently, there is one method that works. Something many different monks, shamans or gurus did in the past, even including jesus (if he was actually real, that is): Staying in complete darkness and silence for a long time. In the past, many different spiritual communities did those "dark room meditations" (look that up on google) where they stayed in a cave meditating for days, weeks or even months and they came out enlightened, capable of levitation and telekinesis. I've even read forum posts about people doing this and afterwards they were capable of mild telekinesis.
The idea behind this is more simple then you'd think. Your brain releases DMT not only when you sleep, but also when you die. It causes all those near-death experiences you may have heard of. So when you want to trip on DMT all you have to do is make your brain think you are dead. Obviously I am simplifying things here to make it more understandable, but when you take away all sensoric inputs for your brain eventually it will conclude "well, if I cannot see, hear or feel anything, I'm probably dead lol" and react to it. This will cause your brain to release DMT over long periods of time which, after a certain amount, even stays in your body more or less permanently, which slowly put you into the dream-state while still allowing you to stay awake. It's important not to interrupt this, though, or else the body will just let go of the DMT just like it does when you stop dreaming. This basically tricks the system and you become capable of manipulating reality around you like you are in your dream, though still limited by the amounts of DMT in your body, your own psyche and the fact that you are not the only conciousness in this dream.
Of course this is much, much harder then it sounds, sitting or laying down completely still in complete darkness and silence doing nothing for two weeks. It's also very hard to find a place where you can pull this off while also having access to water and a toilet.
But - in theory - this SHOULD turn you into a might wizard! It's up to you if you believe this or not, I just wanted to share it and maybe spark some discussion about how one could make this work. Keep in mind that I brutally simplified this, I am aware that, for example, the chemical process is a bit more complicated then what I described.
Well, this wall of text has become big enough. Thanks for reading, make sure to report results if you actually try this!
Seeker 2016-04-17 16:38:01 No.2341
Also check this: http://www.godlikeproductions.com/forum1/message1919363/pg1
Seeker 2016-04-17 16:40:34 No.2342
also, if you have some money, Mantak Chia made such a dark place in Thailand.
http://www.universal-tao.com/dark_room/
There do not seem to be details about when it happens and such, though, so perhaps one needs to email them
I know pseudo-occultists will start babbling and trying to ridicule your points, but can we just ignore them?
Can we talk about details, please?
How 'dark' does the room need to be? Would 80% darkness be enough if you wear eye masks that don't let any light in? I can't make my room darker during the day.
Is it safe to wear earplugs over an extended period? I can't imagine it being a pleasant experience.
Holy shit it fits in one post? Well I guess that pastabin was a bit unneccessary. Sorry.
100% dark or at least very close to that number, at least 80% is deffo not enough. To go a bit more into detail, the problem is that first, your body builds up melantonine (I think that's the right name for it in english?) and then that is in return turned into DMT. When your body reacts to light after building it up, it makes your nose run and you lose all the stuff built up. And that happened to me just by looking at a damn smartphone screen on lowest brightness settings. So yeah, better safe then sorry here.
Yes, complete darkness. You should be unable to see your hand in front of your face, as well as no little glowing lights of any king.
One thing I'd like to ask, is why I can influence reality while being in a wakeful stage? I can go sit down for a few minutes meditate with a certain goal, and manifest something in my reality. Whether it be getting some money, influencing mundanes, or general healing, I never needed to go into a dark room or do it while I was sleeping. I believe DMT only helps with the unbelief that reality is stuck a certain way and is unable to be influenced. DMT basically makes you forget limitations and allows you to manipulate reality. You can still influence reality in a wakeful form, but you need to overcome the negative thinking patterns of you being trapped.
Probability manipulation is much easier then other kinds of magic. The DRM (Dark Room Meditation) gives you telekinesis and possibly even more.
Like I said, I simplified things a lot. Probability manipulation is a huge field of magic that, while very accessable (for example through sigil magic or meditation) is actually pretty complicated when it comes to its science.
Yes, light on the skin also fucks the process. Else you'd see blind guys doing wyrd majicks everywhere, lel.
This might seem like a ridiculous question, but how would you satisfy your physical needs during those 2 weeks of dark room mediation? can you bring drink/food with you?
Seeker 2016-04-17 21:08:54 No.2353
Personally, I'd use that time for fasting, while I'm at it and only drink water. But it probably wouldn't fuck you up if you just bring whatever you want. Just has to last for 2 weeks, obviously.
Using drugs that act a lot like DMT over a long period of time, perhaps? But that'd be too dangerous and the effects would not be permanent.
Seeker 2016-04-18 12:54:45 No.2359
Good read, the room in which I slept has always been perfectly dark so I may as well try to meditate during that time.
Seeker 2016-04-18 14:52:59 No.2361
I didn't know there is a different post limit here compared to 8chan, it did not fit in one post there and I posted it there first.
Seeker 2016-04-18 20:03:41 No.2370
I figure there would be something similar to it but I'm not currently looking to try any substances
Seeker 2016-04-19 01:58:28 No.2374
Nothing what you're saying is wrong, but fuck me it's hard to read. Hire me as your editor, I'll work for free for a good cause.
Would just like to point a few things out.
1) It hasn't been proven that DMT is manufactured in the human brain, nor if it releases upon death.
2) You can ingest any low amount of DMT you like through a variety of methods. Edibles, smoking, vaporization, even nebulization with different dosages from each. The problem isn't that we can't get dosages small enough.
3) Those meditations aren't simulating death. Those very same monks have been documented as saying their meditation consists of constantly processing paradoxes or thought experiments for extended periods of time. You aren't fooling your brain into thinking you're dead by not moving. Senses are still operating, you can feel the ground you're lying on. So long as you can perceive time or know where your limbs are in relation to each other without looking you still have operating senses.
4) These monks have been documented as saying their meditation consists of exclusively processing paradoxes or thought experiments. As our brain synapses constantly change to include new ways of thinking, extensive reworking of the mind's internal wiring could have adverse effects. This is why heavy use of LSD or other indoles causes spontaneous enlightenment effects in many users.
5) The subconscious mind is what controls internal body temperature, electric impulses, etc. so it isn't that much of a leap to conclude this extensive synaptic reworking simply helps facilitate communication to the subconscious and allows for extraordinary effects like augmented memory or physical strength. Hypnotism has been shown, in a few cases, to actually overcome genetic disorders.
There are wizard powers achievable without needing to manipulate a holographic universe or subscribe to the ideas of shared consciousness.
>There are wizard powers achievable without needing to manipulate a holographic universe or subscribe to the ideas of shared consciousness.
Any examples?
I'd deduce based on his flag that he means summoning demons/entities in order to make them do things for you.
He works with his internal demons, aka his shadow self, instead of external demons which is what most people think of. That's actually a very good idea and is the foundation of many areas of psychology, too.
Any more examples besides muscle mass? I'm interested in what processes are beyond our control and require help from entities at a lower level?
I'll refrain from calling you a retard then.
While it's not specifically something that requires help from entities, me and some martial art whose name I forgot basically use energy to move their body at faster speeds.
Essentially it boils down to throwing energy into your arm to make it punch at lightning speeds rather than consciously extending it with your muscles.
Aside from that, what satanist-kun could use as an example is dealing with emotional problems like phobias or bad habits by connecting to the subconsciousness. Although calling it magic is a stretch and I'd personally attribute it to psychology unless of course you want to get into the topic of astral parasites and such.
Control internal body temperature, direct the electrical current in your nervous system, make your heart beat manually, increase or decrease metabolic process efficiency, manage your immune system, dull or eliminate pain, etc.
>energy
Look, energy isn't what you've been calling it. Energy is a quantifiable force in the universe, it's concrete and measurable. Saying that you just use "energy" to do something doesn't mean anything. There's electrical energy, kinetic energy, potential energy and so on and they all mean very different things.
What?
Seeker 2016-04-21 13:29:37 No.2412
>There's electrical energy, kinetic energy, potential energy and so on and they all mean very different things.
You're 100% correct, I should have called it loosh or something to avoid confusion.
I kept it simple so that newbies who don't know anything about these topics can understand it, too. Maybe a bit too simple, I find it hard to keep the balance sometimes.
Obviously "there is that chemical and it gives you superpowers" is a pretty mundane way of explaining it, but that's the point. The real matter obviously lies within releasing the potential of what I call "the dream-self". The chemical is just a tool for that, nothing less, nothing more.
The thing is, anyone who astral projected before will tell you: It's harder then it sounds to actually make use of this state, because when you are dreaming you are usually pretty stupid compared to your awake self. Without training you do not function through thought, but feelings alone. So for example an angry person would just act like a wild animal etc., so my point is you have to learn to overcome this "dream dementia" to actually make practical use of the dream state.
TL;DR Shit's always pretty damn complex, I just tried to keep it simple
Seeker 2016-04-26 17:32:07 No.2516
It's cool, I still gotta get better at explaining stuff so it's kinda my fault.
Seeker 2016-04-26 18:45:54 No.2518
The 'physical' world still has its own rules and effects, right? If DMT opens up certain gateways then I am curious how it does this, and how the effect can be replicated without it.
Seeker 2016-04-27 20:00:16 No.2535
I stopped reading when you said that string theory is the same as the multiple worlds interpretation of the uncertainty principle.
Look, if you are going to use science to justify magic (you wouldn't feel the need to, btw, if you had ever done any magic), please learn something about the science you're citing first. Otherwise you're just a quack spouting pseudoscience.
Or, you know, stop beating around the bush and actually do some sigils or something instead if reading bullshit "occult" threads and wanking on /hebe/.
Read the studies, dummy. DMT is released upon death, never has it been observed while sleeping (and there have been studies trying to observe it).
You're theory is shit I'm afraid.
Seeker 2016-04-27 23:06:06 No.2539
It was never proven to be released upon death also.
But it's true that OP didn't do any research despite calling themselves a scientist.
Seeker 2016-05-01 05:38:35 No.2566
Even if it's not DMT that causes you to "dream" in reality, the point is still that doing so is what gives ya the mad majicks. So while that point in OPs post is very attackable, it's not exactly the backbone of it. Who cares if it's a chemical or something else what causes it, as long as it IS caused?
>Who cares if it's a chemical or something else what causes it, as long as it IS caused?
I care. When studying something, you shouldn't go off of the assumption that something is true without actual proof. While DMT has been found in numerous mammalian brains, it hasn't been located in humans as of now, let alone been proven to release in the event of death.
I can go on TOR and buy DMT right now. It's available for use and study by psychonauts. This would be a wise move if DMT were proven to be a naturally produced compound in the human brain, but could be a complete waste of time until then. Think of it like having a space program before an understanding of gravity.
Seeker 2016-05-08 00:43:37 No.2605
>Even if it's not DMT that causes you to "dream" in reality, the point is still that doing so is what gives ya the mad majicks.
Could you provide any proof or explain the logic behind this claim?
I can claim that shrooms make one able to levitate but if I won't back it up with anything, not even with personal experience as it is the case with this DMT idea, it is meaningless even to discuss it. I'd only look like deluded psychedelics enthusiast.
>Who cares if it's a chemical or something else what causes it, as long as it IS caused?
We do not know if it IS caused at all. If DMT was the holy grail of magic, wouldn't all those people who have consumed it display some kind of magical ability? As far as I'm aware, they do not. They just enjoy a psychedelic trip.
Assuming that the dark room method releases DMT in the brain, I would still be absolutely against doing it. I do not want to consume psychedelics, because then I wouldn't be able to distinguish the real thing (assuming DMT causes any significant increase in magical power) from the illusions created by my drugged up brain. I think that it would be extremely easy to become deluded occultist in this way, thinking that one gained real power when in fact they did not.
Also, as >>2588 already mentioned, there are easier ways to distribute DMT into your system than to sit in the dark for a month.
I'm not against drugs, far from it, but I don't understand why anyone would take the power from themselves and give it to some chemical compound.
So, to sum up: you assume that the dark room method causes DMT to be released in the brain and further assume that even if it does, it actually gives you something apart from just a psychedelic experience.
And, of course, psychedelic experience on it's own can have it's merits too, as shown in the shamanic practice, but it's more of a crutch and not something giving the practitioner "crazy majicks".
It may be, that using psychedelics sends one to regions beyond one's reach at given moment, but nevertheless said regions are achievable by other means.
OP wrote
>So we're running out of options if we want to become wizards, obviously.
We do not. There is a multitude of ways. Some are quicker and some slower, but it depends on the practitioner mostly.
I wanted to suggest to OP using time they otherwise would've spent on researching DMT and entheogens to learn new magical systems or generally advancing in magic, but they didn't do any research anyway.
Seeker 2016-05-08 00:58:10 No.2606
Also, OP claimed that smoked DMT wouldn't work
>However, if you were to just smoke that stuff you would just be send into an individual dream within yourself again or, if you are lucky, you astral project (but that's a different story entirely and I don't want to open that chapter right now). Obviously you don't go god-mode, quite the opposite you become a helpless, drooling little baby in this reality while having a very intense dream experience on the inside. Pretty cool, pretty usefull to get to know yourself and to get in touch with the universe on a spiritual level, but not magic. Why is that?
>The problem is: It's simply too much of it at once, and it doesn't last long enough to take the amount you'd need to be "dreaming" in reality slowly. Some old tribes, especially in Africa, tried to solve this problem by creating a very complicated to brew potion that releases the DMT in a less agressive way, called ayahuasca, but it still sends you to your own dream-land, though from what I have heard in a less intense way. Still, not what we're looking for. (Though I'd still love to get my hands on this stuff.)
But there are some problems with this reasoning.
1. What's the source of the claim that only low dosage gets you desired effects while the high dosage don't?
2. If the problem is the dosage, well, one can always consume less DMT.
3. If the problem is the duration of the trip, one can always smoke more when the effects start to fade.
>mfw Im sitting on a gram of dmt
>mfw small rips allow me to see spirits and thoughtforms walking around thinking they can't be seen
>the gypsy powder is an alluring substance, but it leaves you in a submissive RHP state unless you're on dxm
its really that last part that fucks you up, as lower entities can more easily manipulate and feed off you in the submissive state. But hey, you don't see me stopping just because of some vultures.
Seeker 2016-09-13 19:21:26 No.7663
*i don't fully remember the difference between LHP and RHP but anyway so what he was saying is that DMT makes you more vulnerable to having you energy taken by RHP beings? or something else
Seeker 2016-09-15 12:28:10 No.7704
RHP isn't STO as well as LHP isn't equal to STS.
Imagine a secluded hermit who does yoga all day, dissolved his ego and all that stuff. He is RHP and STS, as in his seclusion he can't really serve anyone else than himself.
In the same way one can be LHP and STO. RHP and LHP only designate the path of magical development while STS and STO describe attitude towards others.
Of course there still can be confusion what constitutes "right hand path" and "left hand path". One of the more common definitions would be that RHP aims to get back to God and become again a part of it, while LHP wants to further separate from God and lead the practitioner to individual Godhood. Of course LHP is also stereotypically edgy and dark.
Some others have a different view - they see both LHP and RHP as having the same goal, only the methods differ, but that still doesn't imply that these paths equal to STS and STO IMHO.
When I was first researching the subject a few years back, I found a quote from Evola on wikipedia about the two Tantrik paths
"There is a significant difference between the two Tantric paths, that of the right hand and that of the left hand (which both are under Shiva's aegis). In the former, the adept always experiences 'someone above him', even at the highest level of realization. In the latter, 'he becomes the ultimate Sovereign' (chakravartin = worldruler)."[19]
Nevertheless, despite my research into Tantra, I haven't found a single text that would directly support this. LHP and RHP in Tantra only designate the school's outlook on breaking social norms, breaking taboos and use of sex and intoxicants. In RHP Tantra they are forbidden, while in LHP they have their place. Maybe I should finally read his book and see if he noted any sources on that.
Anyway, I very like the idea of the whole "separate from God" meme.
Seeker 2016-09-16 18:49:43 No.7728
Dxm works as a manual override to a lot of the subconscious automatic functions running all the time. It makes your energy feel fluid and less dense because now you have to actually focus. This feeling changes over time of getting used to using dxm, but I think its spiritual growth and not just tolerance(which is slow as fuck with dxm anyways). Dxm is also some sort of psyche opening substance, but not in the way psychedelics are. Instead of pushing feelings on you, it separates them from you. The resulting void feels unnatural, so we seek to fill. Usually people I introduce dxm to start noticing "weird" things happening when they trip, or it seeps into their mundane lives. Whatever presence is influencing your life after using dxm, I've found it isn't a negative one. It may test you to your psychological limits if it finds you to be useful for its own agenda. All I've been through from dxm has only made me stronger and accelerated my growth, and I'm only talking about how it's affected me outside of my trips.
Dmt puts you in a submissive RHP mindset, or at least makes you more susceptible to the state. Becoming the amazement and wonder instead of maintaining the self. A lot of entities will take advantage of it.
Seeker 2016-12-04 23:46:07 No.10763
This guy seems like he knows what he's talking about.
Wanna tell us your methods? How can I possibly achieve these things?
>stay in the dark for 2 weeks
What if I go blind, what if my brain loses it power to proceed reality… ?
Do you honestly believe that you'll forget how to think/see if you do something different for 2 weeks? Did you forget how to play a game or drive a car just because you didn't use that skill for a while?
Worry not anon, all it does it allows you to become more aware of other things that you weren't by shifting your focus for that time. You'll be just fine, just more expanded in what you are aware of. Though you'll eventually need to face your fears.
Seeker 2017-01-23 19:18:40 No.12479
I've heard somewhere that staying in the dark for too long gan make you blind
turned out it's not true https://www.quora.com/Is-it-true-that-being-in-complete-darkness-for-more-than-three-days-can-cause-blindness
thnx anon